Bringa Ya Floata to the Mighty Mozola! 7/12

[ERicJ]

Originally Posted by scoot_er

So you base the functionality of the way you measure on one hole that if you ask me is retarded. If it were a hole with a fairway it would be different but there isn't.

No. I base my measurements on the only common distance for everyone who stands at the tee box. The point I was making with Shawshank #13 is that even though there is an obvious tunnel to the basket not every player will use it. Those with advanced skills such as yourself will may chose not to follow the tunnel/clearing/fairway and throw an alternate path. I am not making assumptions about how any or every player will approach the basket.

Now in reality, if I were to make a map of Shawshank I would probably note both the line-of-sight distance as well as the dogleg values.

Originally Posted by ChingLizard

ERic, I think you have your measurement methods correct.

When I stand in a tee box and see a distance, I want to know how far away from the pin I am...not the distance someone else might fly in whatever direction they chose to get there by...

By the alternate method proposed - you would have to anticipate that all throwers will follow the same path/route to get to the basket. This is rarely true. Some folks go up over the top, some folks roll, and the paths everyone takes is different.

The only consistent way to measure distance on a hole is to say when you are standing here (in the tee box) you are 278 feet from the pin.

Yes, that's my basic position on the matter.

Originally Posted by scoot_er

What about #10 at SV? For those going the "normal" route is the hole 280ft? How about hole #12, do you just measure through 13's fairway?

Dunno. Never been there.

And please spare me the: "Gasp! How can you call yourself a disc golfer without ever having played the best course in the Houston area..."

Originally Posted by scoot_er

I will say that 90% of the holes I see like this are FAR from Houston but Measuring straight to the besket doesn't work if you have to follow a totally different line.

If you "have" to follow a different line, i.e. a Mando, then I would measure line-of-sight from the tee to the Mando, and then line-of-sight from the Mando to the basket.

Originally Posted by scoot_er

Just like the distances on a road, there aren't point A to B they are the distance you travel along the road. Surveyors do the same thing measuring using different points along the way not just point A to B.

You don't drive a disc on a road. As long as we're coming up with irrelevant analogies, I think a more accurate analogy is airline flight distance. If you take a non-stop Continental flight from IAH to SJC you get 1,608 miles credited to your OnePass account. I may take that same flight the next week and divert 200 miles out of the way to avoid thunderstorms. We both still get 1,608 miles.

Taking your argument to the Nth degree I should anticpate how high a player is going to throw their disc as the more elevation (Z direction) the disc gets the farther the disc has travelled (for the same distance in the X-Y plane).

Originally Posted by scoot_er

How long is hole #14 on the Wilmont Eric? I know from the long tee used at states it is a 1000ft hole but only 500ft from the basket. How long is it from the short "Normal" tee? What was your measurement?

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course...1/a0637c9a.jpg
You can see from the map I made back in June that I have #14 listed at 812'. On that hole, I felt there was no realistic expectation that any sane player would ever attempt to go directly at the basket. It's also my understanding that you must play around the wetlands in a counter-clockwise direction (as viewed on the map). Given those conditions I took a multi-segment measurement, and documented it as such.

I've traded e-mails with other players on this topic. My methods are documented, and hopefully consistent. I'm not deceiving anyone with the numbers I report. The information is there for the player to use as they see fit.

[Mr. Blue]

Pardon my ignorance, but does the PDGA have a set standard or rule that adresses this topic? It would seem they would. Do they require it to be done a particular way for NT events as this is their top tier event level, it would seem that a certain amount of accuracy in measuring distance would be important for some players.

[ERicJ]

Originally Posted by Suemac

Right there....that's what I'm talking about. Sad, sad day.

Wow. You try to be as PC as possible and you still get slammed....

[ERicJ]

Originally Posted by Suemac

Now the League directors can go online and print them off. Wow!
And what about those folks who only play the courses and not the leagues?

From where does this expectation come that Birdshot is responsible for ensuring that every player carrying is disc is virtually hand delivered an entry form? Is that the way it has been done in the past? Is there no responsibility for the interested player to seek out a tournament on their own?

[scoot_er]

At least you aren't stubborn enough to not see there are instances (#14) where one needs to measure along the fairway and not just straight to the basket.



Maybe there is a little hope


Then again looking at the map 1,2,3,18 look off to me.

[cosmococciccosmodemonic]

Do what is right and facilitate change when things aren't perfect. Having come from a pretty good scene in Birmingham and having played quite a few Austin events, a KC Wide Open and some SN events in Mississippi. DG in Houston is alive and well and if you don't like it, change it, don't try and destroy it. Why would we attempt to make enemies of one another? I just don't get it.

[cosmococciccosmodemonic]

BTW, I'm going to dip yet again into my own pocket and make sure there are some entry forms at the parks for my events. I may even try some other methods for circumventing these issues. I'm on the fence about many of the things Matt and Sue have brought up. The thing is I'm also on the fence about certain things with the way HOTT events work, but I still love them and would play them any chance I get; however, if I had chosen to stop playing HOTT events, that would be it. I wouldn't get on their threads at pdga.com and complain any, I wouldn't even try to suggest change at that point, they would simply not be my type of event. However, since I do play them anytime I can; if I have some sort of issue, I'm more than happy to politely offer my suggestions. I think Matt S. has offered some wonderful suggestions.

[ChingLizard]

Originally Posted by ERicJ

From where does this expectation come that Birdshot is responsible for ensuring that every player carrying is disc is virtually hand delivered an entry form? Is that the way it has been done in the past? Is there no responsibility for the interested player to seek out a tournament on their own?

There isn't any such expectation that I am aware of.

It's a lame excuse to say that there are people with no Internet access around here. If nothing else, there is always the computers with Internet access available at the public libraries around town. Now I can understand that it might not be CONVENIENT for everyone to access it, but my guess is that those folks that find it too inconvenient to get online are probably also likely to find it too inconvenient to fill out a form, put it in an envelope and put on stamp on it too.

None of the Birdshot tourneys seem to be hurting for attendance - so, if it isn't broken...

[Mr. Blue]

Hey Matt,
In believing that we should pracitce what we preach, I will myself download the forms and post them at the courses I play. I play mostly North Side Courses, which I know are out of the way for some of the Birdshot guys. So if the general idea is that the forms should be more readily available, just say the word, and I will GLADLY assist you with the effort.

[Suemac]

Obviously, we all have a computer attached to our backsides, but as much as our society has gone techo, I know of lots of good folks who may be missing out on these events.

I have a personal pet peve about how mankind is being overtaken by technology and forgetting that life exsisted before computers. It is obvious that adjustments can and are being made, and that is all I was trying to accomplish.

One standard form with a box you can check for which event you play, that is a walking advertisement for those who pick it up.

Now, time to shut up and throw!